QJ.net Game Discussion - PSP, Xbox, Wii, PS3, PSP Homebrew, and PSP Guides

**zeroxorxdiexskater** · 08-02-2008, 07:18 AM

ok well i tried to start learning C but i was learning the wrong thing first and its a lot harder than i expected, now somewhere i heard LUA is easier than C so should i stick with C or go to LUA

**MiKeY188** · 08-02-2008, 07:29 AM

its up to you c is also good for windows

where i think lua is mainly PSP. C gives you 2 options. It also depends on what you want to make for the PSP.

**Davee** · 08-02-2008, 07:31 AM

Stick with C. Get some decent books though and you'll do fine.

**Moose** · 08-02-2008, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MiKeY188

its up to you c is also good for windows

where i think lua is mainly PSP. C gives you 2 options. It also depends on what you want to make for the PSP.

You couldn't be more wrong. Games that have used Lua:

Aleph One
Company of Heroes
Crysis
Garry's Mod
Grim Fandango
PlayStation Home
Ragnarok Online
Star Wars: Empire at War and Universe at War: Earth Assault
The Guild 2
World of Warcraft

**Nielkie** · 08-02-2008, 07:51 AM

Go for a middle ground: Python.

**zeroxorxdiexskater** · 08-02-2008, 08:26 AM

o sorry i forgot to mention i am planning on making games, simple ones
and if you decide why i should choose that give me reasons please

**slicer4ever** · 08-02-2008, 09:04 AM

lol, both are used for making games and applications, it's whatever the programmer wants to make, i'd say stick with c, but just slow down, learn some more of the basics(http://forums.qj.net/showpost.php?p=...5&postcount=32), you'll be fine

**mohaas05** · 08-02-2008, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moose Island

You couldn't be more wrong. Games that have used Lua:

Aleph One
Company of Heroes
Crysis
Garry's Mod
Grim Fandango
PlayStation Home
Ragnarok Online
Star Wars: Empire at War and Universe at War: Earth Assault
The Guild 2
World of Warcraft

Lua is only used for certain scripts like missions, etc. Its not used in the actual game programming.

**Moose** · 08-02-2008, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mohaas05

Lua is only used for certain scripts like missions, etc. Its not used in the actual game programming.

I know... I did read the page I posted.

**TurtlesPwn** · 08-02-2008, 10:05 AM

"Lua is only used for certain scripts like missions, etc. Its not used in the actual game programming."
Tell that to the people who made Psychonauts. Lua is responsible for doing 2/3 of what happens in that game, C++ is used for the graphics and the very lowlevel engine.

**PSProgramer** · 08-02-2008, 12:20 PM

it depends on how much effort you are going to put into acctually coding. if you just want to do this for like 6 months, and then your going to quit or get bored with it, then do LUA if you think you might do this for alittle longer, then mabey like C. Although I do suggest Python, more powerful than lua, but it's still a scripting language and is pretty easy to learn.

**zeroxorxdiexskater** · 08-02-2008, 12:28 PM

i will be doing this for much longer than 6 months haha i am taking computer programming, web design, and classes like that this upcoming year in school so hopefully as school goes on this stuff will become much easier but im gonna stick with C i suppose

**Insert_Witty_Name** · 08-02-2008, 12:40 PM

Do yourself a favor and learn both

**mohaas05** · 08-02-2008, 01:14 PM

Lua is good for some things, like more simple applications. But it is not nearly as flexible as C for more specific tasks.

**yaustar** · 08-02-2008, 05:53 PM

For a new programmer and out of the two languages you listed, Lua. However, it doesn't change the fact you STILL need to learn the basics thoroughly before jumping into any non-trivial development.

Personally, I would forget about PSP development for moment and work purely on the PC with Python which is a great language and is simple enough for beginners to great to grips with.

**mohaas05** · 08-02-2008, 06:33 PM

Or if you want to do C, you can start with Java. It has a very similar structure to C. This program is great at teaching it:

http://home.cc.gatech.edu/dorn/jeroo

pspersanonymous · 08-02-2008, 10:15 PM

If you are having trouble learning C then you need a better book (or better tutorials). Don't use PSP tutorials to learn C because quite frankly, most are rubbish. You won't learn C from them, they only teach you the 'how', not the 'why'. So people end up copypasting code thinking they 'know' how to do something but don't understand the logic behind it.

Sure you learn some code that draws some graphics and plays some sounds but you won't understand why a piece of code was written the way it was or how it really works. They also focus too heavily on how to use particular libraries & api's. You won't learn C programming this way.

Just stick with C, grab some good books and go through it step-by-step. Don't skip stuff and go straight to "i wanna create a game". Make sure you fully & completely understand one step before moving on to the next step.

Learning C shouldn't be hard, it is only hard when you are learning from crappy material.

**Anti-QuickJay** · 08-02-2008, 10:51 PM

Learn Python for the computer first.

**wicked_fable** · 08-03-2008, 12:38 AM

Well, speaking as a beginner myself I started learning Lua first. I am also undertaking Python alongside of Lua and am going to take a course on C++ programming in school. For me this is pretty easy because I can learn some basic programming for the PSP which has helped me with learning Python. And Python is, in my opinion, a little bit more in line with some of the more powerful programming languages so it(from what I have seen of C++ from Herbert Shildt's "C++ From the Ground Up") helps me figure out C++ a little bit.

I am just a beginner but I just wanted to show you the way I see things and am learning currently.

**Gefa** · 08-03-2008, 03:12 AM

LUA is very limited, instead C is perfect to program any thing...

**Nielkie** · 08-03-2008, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gefa

LUA is very limited, instead C is perfect to program any thing...

Not really. For writing basic (or even quite advanced) games, it's fine.

**Access_Denied** · 08-03-2008, 11:54 AM

C.
-=Double Post Merge =-

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gefa

LUA is very limited, instead C is perfect to program any thing...

Wrong. Since Lua is based on C, Lua can do everything C can do.

giddo89 · 08-03-2008, 12:21 PM

LUA more user friendly IMO.

**zeroxorxdiexskater** · 08-03-2008, 12:39 PM

im gonna stick with c since ive been already learning about it, i will keep reading tutorials on C/++ and will add onto my game every once in a while, i am gonna take classes on computer programming (a general class on languages which will help me in all the languages) and might release a first version of my game (no guarantee when it will be released or how good it will be)

**Access_Denied** · 08-03-2008, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeroxorxdiexskater

im gonna stick with c since ive been already learning about it, i will keep reading tutorials on C/++ and will add onto my game every once in a while, i am gonna take classes on computer programming (a general class on languages which will help me in all the languages) and might release a first version of my game (no guarantee when it will be released or how good it will be)

That class would probably be a programming theory class. Programming Theory is the part of programming that is universal to all languages. Once you've got a handle on C, take a look at Lua, and you will realize that it's much easier for you to learn a second language.

Also, right choice with C, as it's much more versatile, since it's been ported to many different systems.

a_noob · 08-03-2008, 12:53 PM

LOL, c isnt ported mate, rather there are compilers for most any system

**yaustar** · 08-04-2008, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeroxorxdiexskater

i will keep reading tutorials on C/++ )

C is not the same as C++. Learn one, not both.

a_noob · 08-04-2008, 07:52 AM

Yaustar, *Learn one then both.*

Much better plan. But yeah i believe C is more essential.
And most definately learn on the computer, makes the learning process 100% easier.
Also there is tons of documentation for what ever you plan to do on the pc but for the psp, there is less documentation and less support, remember the psp sdk is not official but rather a collection of stubbed Official functions, IE we found where they reside in memory and call them.

**lukespalding** · 08-04-2008, 09:13 AM

personallyi think that everybody who has posted here has good reason for what they have said but ye c might be more versatile etc and lua may be low level but its down to you have how quickly you grasp information, if you do grasp thing quickly then id say start with c but then again when i started i did not have a clue where to start so i decided to go with lua and i actually picked it up quite fast made few little progs then decided to go for c and because i did that im picking c up faster than i expected lol

If you have started coding with C which i think you have then stick with C and dont rush it, take it all in and think logical its not the language thats good its the coder, the language does not make the game the coder does, the language is an essential part but itdoes not matter you can still do alot of things in lua which you can do in C it just takes time.

lol now ive finished my rant of crap ill leave you to rack your brain lol
Luke

**michaelp** · 08-04-2008, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lukespalding

personallyi think that everybody who has posted here has good reason for what they have said but ye c might be more versatile etc and lua may be low level but its down to you have how quickly you grasp information, if you do grasp thing quickly then id say start with c but then again when i started i did not have a clue where to start so i decided to go with lua and i actually picked it up quite fast made few little progs then decided to go for c and because i did that im picking c up faster than i expected lol

If you have started coding with C which i think you have then stick with C and dont rush it, take it all in and think logical its not the language thats good its the coder, the language does not make the game the coder does, the language is an essential part but itdoes not matter you can still do alot of things in lua which you can do in C it just takes time.

lol now ive finished my rant of crap ill leave you to rack your brain lol
Luke

Lua is a higher level language than C, not lower level.

08-02-2008, 07:18 AM	#1
zeroxorxdiexskater Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: 3.03OE-C Posts: 1,098 Trader Feedback: 0	C or LUA ok well i tried to start learning C but i was learning the wrong thing first and its a lot harder than i expected, now somewhere i heard LUA is easier than C so should i stick with C or go to LUA __________________ CuRrEnT fIrMwArE [SIZE="3"][FONT="Times New Roman"][COLOR="Red"][B][I][U]3.90 M33-2 SLIM TA-085V2 with TimeMachine 0.1[/U][/I][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [WIP] Trogdor! (ON HOLD converting to LUA, but almost caught up)

08-02-2008, 07:51 AM	#5
Nielkie Developer Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 549 Trader Feedback: 0	Go for a middle ground: Python. __________________

08-02-2008, 08:26 AM	#6
zeroxorxdiexskater Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: 3.03OE-C Posts: 1,098 Trader Feedback: 0	o sorry i forgot to mention i am planning on making games, simple ones and if you decide why i should choose that give me reasons please __________________ CuRrEnT fIrMwArE [SIZE="3"][FONT="Times New Roman"][COLOR="Red"][B][I][U]3.90 M33-2 SLIM TA-085V2 with TimeMachine 0.1[/U][/I][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [WIP] Trogdor! (ON HOLD converting to LUA, but almost caught up)

08-02-2008, 09:04 AM	#7
slicer4ever Developer Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: everywhere Posts: 3,357 Trader Feedback: 0	lol, both are used for making games and applications, it's whatever the programmer wants to make, i'd say stick with c, but just slow down, learn some more of the basics(http://forums.qj.net/showpost.php?p=...5&postcount=32), you'll be fine __________________ 1. Failed....again... 2. http://slicer.gibbocool.com/ stay updated on all my projects

08-02-2008, 12:28 PM	#12
zeroxorxdiexskater Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: 3.03OE-C Posts: 1,098 Trader Feedback: 0	i will be doing this for much longer than 6 months haha i am taking computer programming, web design, and classes like that this upcoming year in school so hopefully as school goes on this stuff will become much easier but im gonna stick with C i suppose __________________ CuRrEnT fIrMwArE [SIZE="3"][FONT="Times New Roman"][COLOR="Red"][B][I][U]3.90 M33-2 SLIM TA-085V2 with TimeMachine 0.1[/U][/I][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [WIP] Trogdor! (ON HOLD converting to LUA, but almost caught up)

08-02-2008, 07:29 AM	#2
MiKeY188 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Ireland Posts: 979 Trader Feedback: 0	its up to you c is also good for windows where i think lua is mainly PSP. C gives you 2 options. It also depends on what you want to make for the PSP.

08-02-2008, 07:31 AM	#3
Davee Enter Custom Title Join Date: Sep 2006 Real First Name: Davee Location: Perth, Scotland Posts: 1,041 Trader Feedback: 0	Stick with C. Get some decent books though and you'll do fine.

08-02-2008, 10:05 AM	#10
TurtlesPwn Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 612 Trader Feedback: 0	"Lua is only used for certain scripts like missions, etc. Its not used in the actual game programming." Tell that to the people who made Psychonauts. Lua is responsible for doing 2/3 of what happens in that game, C++ is used for the graphics and the very lowlevel engine.

08-02-2008, 12:20 PM	#11
PSProgramer Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 498 Trader Feedback: 0	it depends on how much effort you are going to put into acctually coding. if you just want to do this for like 6 months, and then your going to quit or get bored with it, then do LUA if you think you might do this for alittle longer, then mabey like C. Although I do suggest Python, more powerful than lua, but it's still a scripting language and is pretty easy to learn.

08-02-2008, 01:14 PM	#14
mohaas05 Join Date: Jan 2007 Real First Name: mohaas05 Location: Land of honey Just Played: San Andreas Posts: 4,255 Trader Feedback: 0	Lua is good for some things, like more simple applications. But it is not nearly as flexible as C for more specific tasks. __________________ www.mohaas05.co.cc

08-02-2008, 05:53 PM	#15
yaustar Developer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: UK Posts: 2,317 Trader Feedback: 0	For a new programmer and out of the two languages you listed, Lua. However, it doesn't change the fact you STILL need to learn the basics thoroughly before jumping into any non-trivial development. Personally, I would forget about PSP development for moment and work purely on the PC with Python which is a great language and is simple enough for beginners to great to grips with. __________________ [Blog] [Portfolio] [Homebrew Illuminati - Serious Homebrew Development Forums] [I want to make Homebrew FAQ] [How I broke into the Games Industry] [Programming Book List] [Programming Article List]

08-02-2008, 06:33 PM	#16
mohaas05 Join Date: Jan 2007 Real First Name: mohaas05 Location: Land of honey Just Played: San Andreas Posts: 4,255 Trader Feedback: 0	Or if you want to do C, you can start with Java. It has a very similar structure to C. This program is great at teaching it: http://home.cc.gatech.edu/dorn/jeroo __________________ www.mohaas05.co.cc

08-02-2008, 10:15 PM	#17
pspersanonymous Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 46 Trader Feedback: 0	If you are having trouble learning C then you need a better book (or better tutorials). Don't use PSP tutorials to learn C because quite frankly, most are rubbish. You won't learn C from them, they only teach you the 'how', not the 'why'. So people end up copypasting code thinking they 'know' how to do something but don't understand the logic behind it. Sure you learn some code that draws some graphics and plays some sounds but you won't understand why a piece of code was written the way it was or how it really works. They also focus too heavily on how to use particular libraries & api's. You won't learn C programming this way. Just stick with C, grab some good books and go through it step-by-step. Don't skip stuff and go straight to "i wanna create a game". Make sure you fully & completely understand one step before moving on to the next step. Learning C shouldn't be hard, it is only hard when you are learning from crappy material.

08-02-2008, 10:51 PM	#18
Anti-QuickJay lol Join Date: Aug 2006 Real First Name: Robert Location: Whittier, CA Just Played: Madden 10 Posts: 5,791 Trader Feedback: 0	Learn Python for the computer first.

08-03-2008, 12:38 AM	#19
wicked_fable Raining My Mood: Join Date: Jun 2005 Real First Name: Daniel Location: In The Fog... Just Played: Persona 4 Posts: 545 Trader Feedback: 0	Well, speaking as a beginner myself I started learning Lua first. I am also undertaking Python alongside of Lua and am going to take a course on C++ programming in school. For me this is pretty easy because I can learn some basic programming for the PSP which has helped me with learning Python. And Python is, in my opinion, a little bit more in line with some of the more powerful programming languages so it(from what I have seen of C++ from Herbert Shildt's "C++ From the Ground Up") helps me figure out C++ a little bit. I am just a beginner but I just wanted to show you the way I see things and am learning currently. __________________ RetroEmu Last edited by wicked_fable; 08-03-2008 at 12:58 AM..

08-03-2008, 03:12 AM	#20
Gefa Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Italy Posts: 138 Trader Feedback: 0	LUA is very limited, instead C is perfect to program any thing...

08-03-2008, 12:21 PM	#23
giddo89 Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 11 Trader Feedback: 0	LUA more user friendly IMO.

08-03-2008, 12:39 PM	#24
zeroxorxdiexskater Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: 3.03OE-C Posts: 1,098 Trader Feedback: 0	im gonna stick with c since ive been already learning about it, i will keep reading tutorials on C/++ and will add onto my game every once in a while, i am gonna take classes on computer programming (a general class on languages which will help me in all the languages) and might release a first version of my game (no guarantee when it will be released or how good it will be) __________________ CuRrEnT fIrMwArE [SIZE="3"][FONT="Times New Roman"][COLOR="Red"][B][I][U]3.90 M33-2 SLIM TA-085V2 with TimeMachine 0.1[/U][/I][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [WIP] Trogdor! (ON HOLD converting to LUA, but almost caught up)

08-03-2008, 12:53 PM	#26
a_noob No longer a community member. Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Over there. Posts: 666 Trader Feedback: 0	LOL, c isnt ported mate, rather there are compilers for most any system

08-04-2008, 07:52 AM	#28
a_noob No longer a community member. Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Over there. Posts: 666 Trader Feedback: 0	Yaustar, Learn one then both. Much better plan. But yeah i believe C is more essential. And most definately learn on the computer, makes the learning process 100% easier. Also there is tons of documentation for what ever you plan to do on the pc but for the psp, there is less documentation and less support, remember the psp sdk is not official but rather a collection of stubbed Official functions, IE we found where they reside in memory and call them.

08-04-2008, 09:13 AM	#29
lukespalding Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: East Midlands, UK Posts: 66 Trader Feedback: 0	personallyi think that everybody who has posted here has good reason for what they have said but ye c might be more versatile etc and lua may be low level but its down to you have how quickly you grasp information, if you do grasp thing quickly then id say start with c but then again when i started i did not have a clue where to start so i decided to go with lua and i actually picked it up quite fast made few little progs then decided to go for c and because i did that im picking c up faster than i expected lol If you have started coding with C which i think you have then stick with C and dont rush it, take it all in and think logical its not the language thats good its the coder, the language does not make the game the coder does, the language is an essential part but itdoes not matter you can still do alot of things in lua which you can do in C it just takes time. lol now ive finished my rant of crap ill leave you to rack your brain lol Luke

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C or LUA