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My theory on AI: do you think it will work?

This is a discussion on My theory on AI: do you think it will work? within the PSP Development Forum forums, part of the PSP Development, Hacks, and Homebrew category; The past few days, I have been thinking about AI, and thought up something interesting. Its a simple layout for ...

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Old 01-12-2007, 05:30 PM   #1

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Default My theory on AI: do you think it will work?

The past few days, I have been thinking about AI, and thought up something interesting.
Its a simple layout for advanced artificial intelligence, one that you could talk to and have an interesting conversation with.
Heres my layout I thought up, first here is the diagram for what I call the 'virtual brain':






And here is the diagram for the interface that will use the brain:





To me, it seems like it would work, but I'm not sure. Any ideas?

Also, please, no spamming this with stuff like 'awesome, cant wait!', I am simply looking for an answer.
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:48 PM   #2

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So you can ask this a question and will it be able to answer? Or just a convo?
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:52 PM   #3

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It should be able to communicate with a user as if it were another person.
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:54 PM   #4

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Will their be a limit to how long it can talk for?
Will their be a limit on how long a single sentence will be?
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:55 PM   #5

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Can you help me figure that out?
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:57 PM   #6

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reminds me of smarterchild from instant messaging
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:58 PM   #7

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Can can a conversation last forever as long as i keep talking to it, And when if i ask it a question or something, Will it respond in short answers or will it be able to talk back with more than one sentence at a time?
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:58 PM   #8
 
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this is actually quite interesting.

would this be able to respond fast enough? There may be a possibility that the psp may take some time to process the information. This would be great in games for story lines.

Edit: would it be capable of debating between situations? can a human outsmart this through debating a topic?
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Old 01-12-2007, 05:58 PM   #9
 
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Seems like it would work. The hardest thing i believe would be the AIs use/statement of it's viritual knowlage saved in file/files. Good luck!
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Old 01-12-2007, 06:04 PM   #10

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Guys, stop asking me questions, I already stated that I don't know how well this system is, and also stated not to spam.

And I believe it may be fast enough for games with an advanced quick dictionary lookup.
-= Double Post =-
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaxxBlaster
Seems like it would work. The hardest thing i believe would be the AIs use/statement of it's viritual knowlage saved in file/files. Good luck!
The only file saved would be dictionary. The bot would be init'd with custom values, and reset after each session.
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Old 01-12-2007, 06:07 PM   #11
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youresam
Guys, stop asking me questions, I already stated that I don't know how well this system is, and also stated not to spam.

And I believe it may be fast enough for games with an advanced quick dictionary lookup.
-= Double Post =-

The only file saved would be dictionary. The bot would be init'd with custom values, and reset after each session.
Ok, but how will it know what you are talking about? There must be some kind of recognicion file saved as well. It would be fun if it diden't replyed completely random.
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Old 01-12-2007, 06:11 PM   #12

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Quote:
Originally Posted by (X)
reminds me of smarterchild from instant messaging
lol that would be awesome to have on the PSP
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Old 01-12-2007, 06:17 PM   #13

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HaxxBlaster
Ok, but how will it know what you are talking about? There must be some kind of recognicion file saved as well. It would be fun if it diden't replyed completely random.
The state part of the brain would take care of all of that.
For example, if someone asked 'whats your favorate color?', and it replys 'red', then you ask 'why?', it would know that the last subject was colors, then search the knowledge part of the brain for why its favorate color is red. Chances are that it doesnt know, so it might reply 'I dont know'
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Originally Posted by Yongobongo
lol that would be awesome to have on the PSP
lol READ THE TOPIC OR GET OFF THIS THREAD
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Old 01-12-2007, 06:47 PM   #14
 
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Youresam I think there should be a word saving cause if the brain say: "What was the last subject" it me get mest up if you ask more question about that subject without actuly talking about it since ther is no real subject to the phrase EG: "What is your favorite color?" then "Why?" let say "Are you shure? then there is no real subject to the last sentence.I should maybe save words of the first sentence or something of a sort.But the problem would be when to erase the current subject of the AI memory whiout having it to mess up multipe subjects.
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Old 01-12-2007, 07:10 PM   #15

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It basically falls down to
Input -> Analysation -> Response

The input from the user is parsed for verbs, adjectives and nouns via lookup (as you mentioned). The AI will have to anaylse the phrase and build up some form of data structure that links the verbs, adjectives and nouns together to derive what is being said. Essentially it is almost a database/query system at this point. You can say that "The sky is blue" and later ask "What colour is the sky?". Of course the AI has to asscioate 'colour' with 'blue' before it can answer this question which all depends how much 'base knowledge' you give and what it can recognise.

The response is probably the most difficult area and it sounds like you want to implement a self modifying fuzzy logic system where it has a list of decisions based on the input, all with weightings that have been adjusted based on previous input. Actually constructing a human readable sentence will prove difficult as well based on the decision. I suppose this can be done with a lookup table of sorts and a 'mix and match' or token system or a REALLY large lookup table. To be honest, this isn't really my area of expertise, not on this scale anyway.

The feasible of this will all depend on how much you want to 'dumb down' the system. The larger the range of input, the more complex this becomes.
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Old 01-12-2007, 07:24 PM   #16

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Yeah, I know parsing/recontructing sentences wont be easy, which is why I just drew a picture for now. I know parsing wont be so hard because of a quick dictionary lookup for each word, and it would be able to pinpoint exactly what it is asking.

I was thinking about the way we think (ironic enough). If someone comes up to you and says that 'blah' is green. Although you have no clue what 'blah' is, you associate it with a noun and store it in your brain. Now, if someone later came up and asked what 'blah' was, you would say 'green', even though you dont even really know what it is.

Reconstructing sentences, although seems almost impossible, shouldnt bee as hard as it seems. If you know what kind of a sentence to make, mixed with how you are feeling (mood), the framework should be created.

I think once the system is complete, it should be almost flawless. I dont think there is a 'halfway mark' for understandability.
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Old 01-12-2007, 07:31 PM   #17

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Like I said, it depends how far you want to scale it up and how realistic do you want the brain to be to a human person. The response can easily be based on a template system. eg:

"What is [noun]?"
"Why is [noun] [adjective]?"

But it may feel 'rigid' to the user.

You might also want to do a relevance weighting between words so when a group of words are used, you can analyse them for relevance to each other.
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Old 01-12-2007, 07:44 PM   #18
 
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There are a lot of books on AI. Have you read any?

Personally, I don't see how AI could manufacture anything interesting, as it can never have experience. Complex answers are possible, but it would take too much time and effort for the programmer to write (It's taken 4.6 billion years to write our minds, and we're not always interesting; this isn't interesting). If I asked it, "How would you contrast character development in Updike's 'A&P' with that of Kafka's 'The Trial?,' how could it ever provide an interesting response? No one who isn't already sated is interested in a stream of "I don't know"s.

EDIT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by youresam
I was thinking about the way we think (ironic enough). If someone comes up to you and says that 'blah' is green. Although you have no clue what 'blah' is, you associate it with a noun and store it in your brain. Now, if someone later came up and asked what 'blah' was, you would say 'green', even though you dont even really know what it is.
I might say (after scanning my mind), "I've heard it's green," as I can't rely on 'someone's' information (a determination I've somehow learned to make). I'd then add some idiot colloquialism (for some reason I can't currently understand) based on what I can discern of the new person's manner (a complicated process that draws on all my influenced and freely developed (through some process) stereotypes).

The problem is, 'blah=green' isn't just stored in your brain, in some table or specific container. It goes through a few procedures, is probably discarded, and if it is stored, it is constantly moving, altering, connecting with other bits. It gets used in searches, searched for, disected, complicated, disconnected, and maybe used to gather a new bit of information. I don't know enough to explain it any further, and no one can fully explain it. You can't reasonably program anything to work at the same level, or even a good fraction of the level as the human brain in order to produce an interesting conversation.

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Old 01-12-2007, 08:10 PM   #19

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Ive never read a single book relating to computers or computer concepts, sadly.

As I like to do stuff on my own, I develop theorys on how stuff is done, and this is one.
You talk about how it is malformed over time, that is why I implemented the concept of timestamps. Through a logical formula using the last time accessed and the number of times access, the data can be made less useful and more dificult to access.
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Old 01-12-2007, 09:26 PM   #20

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youresam - your idea should work, but i cannot find any good purposes for it. it will also be slow, because you will have to make the AI check if its own sentence is right.

read on neural nets, they are hard, but widely applicable.
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Old 01-13-2007, 03:57 AM   #21
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youresam
The state part of the brain would take care of all of that.
For example, if someone asked 'whats your favorate color?', and it replys 'red', then you ask 'why?', it would know that the last subject was colors, then search the knowledge part of the brain for why its favorate color is red. Chances are that it doesnt know, so it might reply 'I dont know'
-= Double Post =-

lol READ THE TOPIC OR GET OFF THIS THREAD
It's what i thought, i may be difficult. Are you going to get started with this now?
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Old 01-13-2007, 08:30 AM   #22

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Quote:
Originally Posted by youresam
Ive never read a single book relating to computers or computer concepts, sadly.

As I like to do stuff on my own, I develop theorys on how stuff is done, and this is one.
You talk about how it is malformed over time, that is why I implemented the concept of timestamps. Through a logical formula using the last time accessed and the number of times access, the data can be made less useful and more dificult to access.
Well worth reading around this topic, many of the problems have already been solved in one way or another.

Why not take a look at the source for classic conversational AIs, like Alice etc. ?

This is all a MUCH more complex problem than you think it is, judging from your posts. Well worth getting some insight from the experts who have been researching this full time for decades.
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Old 01-13-2007, 09:43 AM   #23

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fanjita
Well worth reading around this topic, many of the problems have already been solved in one way or another.

Why not take a look at the source for classic conversational AIs, like Alice etc. ?

This is all a MUCH more complex problem than you think it is, judging from your posts. Well worth getting some insight from the experts who have been researching this full time for decades.

alice? never heard of it. is it open source?

youresam- i know you like to make/invent your own stuff, but there will come a time when you have to use somebody else's work. just be ready for it.

again, neural nets are have a lot more uses than this.
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Old 01-13-2007, 11:34 AM   #24
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ALICE really isnt AI... it just takes what you say and compares it to a database of words with what should happen next. for example... everytime i say "no" Alice always replies "are you serious" so as you can see it is not truly understanding the conversation.
"if i ask why are you smart" and "why are you stupid" i get the same response, it sees the
"why are you" and then doesnt care what the rest is (i can say why are you kad;flkajdlfkjass and still get a response)
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Old 01-13-2007, 01:25 PM   #25
 
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This seems real interesting and im sure it would work (With certain limitations, ofcourse )
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Old 01-13-2007, 03:30 PM   #26
 
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youresam, don't dabble into such thoughts with AI. In my Java class we had to do something similiar and after awhile it gets boring and repetitive. There are just too many different situations that the AI will be able to handle. We even made a custom interface so you could input more logic into to it. After awhile the dictionary was over 2gb and it still couldn't answer simple questions. Did I mention this program was insanely boring to create?
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Old 01-13-2007, 05:43 PM   #27

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Fanjita, I really doubt the source will be...understandable. I really like starting things fresh, and dont want to spend time reading source code. Besides, from what I've heard it can do, thats not what I'm aiming for.

Diablo, I understand that the english language is very complex, but I think that even a basic AI system would be fantastic. I have a 100kb dictionary file from firefox, so I dont think the dictionary file will be a problem.
Sure working on AI could be a complete failure, but it just feels so possible. Look:

>How are you?
'?' identifies a question
'How' looks up 'state of being'
'are' would be ignored.
'you' is refering to the AI.
It would then look into its state for how it is, how it is feeling, ect, then create a reply:
'I' because the question was directed at it.
'am' because it was state-of-being.
'fine' is the word it found to describe


I know that was simple and other questions are far harder, but again, the concept just seems....easy.
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Old 01-13-2007, 06:09 PM   #28

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At this point, the best way to find out is to try for yourself to find out how complex the problem actually is.
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Old 01-13-2007, 06:25 PM   #29

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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaustar
At this point, the best way to find out is to try for yourself to find out how complex the problem actually is.
k.***
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Old 01-13-2007, 08:07 PM   #30
 
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Youresam I think the best way for you to figured all you question out is by actully trying to make but just to test it out be maybe making you a little list of question which the AI shounld answer to.But other wise nothing is real some PPL may state alot of there opinion but if you didn't try you will never find the answer out.
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