DVD9 is more than big enough

[whitehawk]

Dude, HDMI isn't a necessity. They added it, but it's not like the old users actually needed it to enjoy games.

With HD-DVD, old users would HAVE to buy the add-on..
Seriously.. It's never happening.

[Sinfulfate]

Originally Posted by user friendly

Much higher bandwidth, allows for deep colour (when used) and a higher resolution is possible. Sony made this thing almost 100% future proof. Still needs games though.

A video game console without good games is pretty pointless don't you think?

[whitehawk]

Originally Posted by user friendly

Much higher bandwidth, allows for deep colour (when used) and a higher resolution is possible. Sony made this thing almost 100% future proof. Still needs games though.

Most of those features seem useless to me, at least for a game console. HDMI 1.2 is fine. 1080p is here to stay for a long time, and I doubt most people could tell the difference between 24 and 48 bit.

Besides, even DVI and VGA can do 1200p, and could probably do 1600p. Seems like their just forcing a newer HDMI on consumers.

Why can't they just make a final HDMI design and stick with it?
-= Double Post =-

Originally Posted by Sinfulfate

A video game console without good games is pretty pointless don't you think?

Presto!

[Shatterdome]

To Aduivo...that same article says there are just as many holdbacks with the PS3, so don't try to use as an attack on 360, as Rockstar said PS3 is just as bad...

That's the thing...blu-ray can hold more information, great, but it loads that information ridiculously slow, and they are not even maxing out the format.....so ya, to compensate games are just installing information onto the HDD anyways and replicating data 3-4times over, which totally negates the advantage of having alot of space on one disk. Therefore if MS allowed devs to install to HDD (more likely then using the HD-DVD, as almost no one has the HD-DVD add-on) then there would be no real difference between the two....as both system would be installing info to the HDD before playing.

Then what happens when/if games do reach 50gig and you have to install 15-30 of it on your HDD to play it at any enjoyable rate ? No wonder they included an HDD in every PS3...

It's very feasible that this statement by Bizzare is true...I could see them focusing more on the weather effects then trying to create day and night conditions for each track. Especially when day/night on some tracks is a worse experience....really you only need nightime for vegas, tokyo and now shanghai...

So if they were upping the quality of their textures and either had to spend all that time to make night/day for every city and no dynamic weather...or make night and day for specific cities and get dynamic weather....i'd take the latter, which we got....although, maybe holding off on releasing it for 6 months so we could get both would have been nice too. It's been less then a year since the last one, that's just too short of a timespan....oh well...

I guess the truth will be told when we see the iso and if it's under 9gigs (roughly)

[whitehawk]

I read that Gears of War was on a DVD-5. Is this true?

[Realn0whereman]

Originally Posted by whitehawk

Most of those features seem useless to me, at least for a game console. HDMI 1.2 is fine. 1080p is here to stay for a long time, and I doubt most people could tell the difference between 24 and 48 bit.

Besides, even DVI and VGA can do 1200p, and could probably do 1600p. Seems like their just forcing a newer HDMI on consumers.

Why can't they just make a final HDMI design and stick with it?
-= Double Post =-
Presto!

Newer technology means newer ****. if we had usb 1.0 and u wouldnt say that if u knew usb 2.0 was possible.

[user friendly]

Originally Posted by Sinfulfate

A video game console without good games is pretty pointless don't you think?

Yeah, that would be pretty pointless. Good thing PS3 has some, it just needs more. It's still pretty young and Ive seen about 4 games that I really like/want, that I consider good games.

[KINGOFNOOBS]

The fact is that Microsoft is cheap, everyone (including PC's) have used a upgraded form of media, the Wii upgraded from miniDisk to DVD based media, PS3 from DVD to Blu Ray, Microsoft could've even made they're own propriety media (like Dreamcast did) that could hold around 20GB.

They even said themselves that it would be a problem, hence the extreme compression methods they have came up with.

That being said, good games can still be done with DVDs. But Blu-Ray will end up being better, its imminent.

[Captain Bodymod]

Well, I still enjoy playing some of my 3MB roms on the Snes and Genesis more than some of todays huge games.

Size doesn't matter, it's how you use it

[Realn0whereman]

Originally Posted by Serideth

Well, I still enjoy playing some of my 3MB roms on the Snes and Genesis more than some of todays huge games.

Size doesn't matter, it's how you use it

ah how dirty :P

[z3ddicus]

Well remember what I said about games requiring the HDD in the future? http://xbox360.qj.net/Rumor-Future-X...g/49/aid/99054

[Shatterdome]

Originally Posted by whitehawk

I read that Gears of War was on a DVD-5. Is this true?

No, the ISO is 6.3 gigs...

[nights]

How much compression are the devs at Bizarre using?

[twelve]

@Sinfulfate and Ciaran: You're both right, they didn't say that, I was mistaken.

UF followed with this which is what I was thinking of:
"I remember them saying HDMI wasn't needed, when referring to the PS3."

Anyway back on the topic of disk space.

Originally Posted by Shatterdome

No, the ISO is 6.3 gigs...

Wrong, the rar file is 6.3GB.

But decompressed and ready for burning every xbox 360 game is 7.05GB (this is due to the disc structure).

So MS have a few GB to play with on the disc, however it will mean changing the disc structure, which may make piracy easier (by removing protection to free the space up) or harder (by changing the protection completely meaning hackers start from scratch).

[Shatterdome]

Originally Posted by Phil

Wrong, the rar file is 6.3GB.

But decompressed and ready for burning every xbox 360 game is 7.05GB (this is due to the disc structure).

Interesting, I didn't "mod" my box this time around so I wasn't aware of that. Just checked the ISO in the usual place....

So is it a pad file of some sorts, so that even dinky games like surfs up or something else dumb always end up being 7.05 ?

[twelve]

Yeah basically. It's all padded out to 7.05GB it also means that games are restricted to that size even tho the disc capacity is higher.

[user friendly]

Originally Posted by Phil

@Sinfulfate and Ciaran: You're both right, they didn't say that, I was mistaken.

UF followed with this which is what I was thinking of:
"I remember them saying HDMI wasn't needed, when referring to the PS3."

Sorry to keep this going but:

I swear to god MS said that HDMI wasn't needed, same with 1080p.

Like I posted in the 360 E3 thread, if devs start complaining enough maybe MS will put an HD drive internal or utilize the add on. But if/when blu ray wins, Peter Moore said a blu ray drive is possible.

Then MS told him to say this:

Originally Posted by Moore

"absolutely no plans to support other optical formats" (i.e. under no circumstances will they be releasing a Blu-ray drive for their flagship home entertainment device), and that they remain "fully Committed to HD DVD."

Whatever though, doesn't change the fact that it's a fun system.

[Sinfulfate]

Originally Posted by user friendly

Sorry to keep this going but:

I swear to god MS said that HDMI wasn't needed, same with 1080p.

They did say that because it isn't needed(tho I don't recall them saying anything about 1080p). They only added HDMI because there customers wanted it.

[Shatterdome]

Yeah, I recall MS saying HDMI wasn't needed as well, as they felt most consumers had TV's with composite inputs, and the increased bandwidth of HDMI is really only needed for playing HD movies at 1080P.

1080P they said was not feasible for gaming, as they knew that to run a game at that resolution it would have to be a pretty craptacular game graphics wise, and anything like Gears quality would never go beyond 720P.

But, people *****ed and they gave a software update for 1080P....then with that enabled it gave them a reason to use HDMI, as it was now possible to play 1080P movies, which means that higher bandwidth was actually needed...

[user friendly]

So what this all boils down too is:

M.S: "HDMI isn't needed for gaming this generation"...... they added it.

M.S: "1080p isn't needed either"...... they added that too.

M.S: "We will never use HDDVD as an optical media for games, DVD9 is plenty with our amazing compression techniques"..... still waiting on that one.

[Shatterdome]

Not really, because those are not needed for gaming....they said HDMI wasn't needed, and that 1080P wasn't feasible...both statements are true. But once they broke down and added 1080P support, then HDMI was "needed", or at least could be used....at 720P with 5.1 Dolby digital there are no advantages to HDMI other then ease of use (one thing to plug in) and DRM...

But since consumers wanted both, they did it, one leading to them making more money.

Also, any game that would require the HD-DVD would not sell, less then 2% of 360 owners have the hd-dvd add-on....more then likely we will see them add installs like PS3 to the HDD, or background caching.....because I think less then 2% of 360 owners do not have an HDD....

[user friendly]

Originally Posted by Shatterdome

Also, any game that would require the HD-DVD would not sell, less then 2% of 360 owners have the hd-dvd add-on....

Yeah, I agree there. Alienation is not something MS would want to do to their customers. It's too late in the game to add HDDVD as an option, thats where I think they went wrong. If devs are claiming these issues this early on, how big are these issues going to become in the future.

[whitehawk]

If they added HD-DVD, they would have had to launch in 2006, alongside the PS3, and then the 360 would lose. Microsoft knew they needed a head start, so they launched a year earlier, and so far it has helped a lot.

[Adiuvo]

IMO, the 360's head start was one of it's greatest problems. If more testing would have been done on the 360 then the RLoD problem would not be so big. They could have still won the console war if they continued to produce such great games like the ones we have now.

[whitehawk]

I remember just before the 360 came out, TIME had a big article on it, and they had a picture about Microsoft testing the hardware. What was in the picture exactly? A 360 on its side with a plate of food and a can of pop on it. Yeh, that's some rigorous testing there Microsoft.

[Synyster gates]

Originally Posted by whitehawk

A 360 on its side with a plate of food and a can of pop on it. Yeh, that's some rigorous testing there Microsoft.

I thought everyone uses their 360 as a dinner tray, I know I do.